Removing the Woo of Energy Work with Brenda Winkle
“It doesn't matter what you're charging, as long as there's an energy exchange that feels energy rich to you.”
In the past, I’ve been so adverse to energy work because I felt like the space was honestly filled with a lot of bullshit. However, while hosting the Media Genius event, I met Brenda Winkle and that all changed. Brenda is an educator, healer, speaker, and guide who helps sensitive and successful high performers find, reclaim and live from their full embodied YES and I am so excited to have her on Strategy Snacks this week. In our conversation, we chat about what an even energy exchange feels like and how this can be a guide when creating pricing in your business. Brenda also shares the power of doing nothing and how this can actually jumpstart a creative state for you. I absolutely loved this conversation and I think you will, too.
Topics:
How Brenda completely changed Frenchie’s perspective of energy work and healing
What a Yes Filled Life is and how Brenda has made this the foundation of her work
The history of energy and the different modalities of healing and how Brenda relies on the science to reduce skepticism
Why mindset work alone does not work in overcoming limiting beliefs and behaviors
What it looks like to run a business as an energy healer
Brenda’s biggest win after owning her own business for one year
Debunking the belief that energy healers should be working for free and the concept of an energy exchange
The lessons that Brenda has learned from charging her worth to holding working hour boundaries and how this made her work feel richer
The power of creating white space in your calendar and really doing nothing
Episode Resources:
- Join the waitlist for Business Genius Bootcamp
About Brenda:
Brenda Winkle is an educator, healer, speaker, and guide who helps sensitive and successful high performers find, reclaim and live from their full embodied YES. Through empowering her clients to understand whats theirs/what's not, establish the boundaried YES, and guiding them to full-capacity living, they are able to create their YES-Filled Lives and move through their days with more freedom, ease, and joy. She does this through trauma-informed breathwork, somatic coaching and energy healing.
For more from Brenda, be sure to:
- Visit her website
- Follow her on Instagram: @brendawinkle
- Free Download: Breathwork to Strengthen and Trust Intuition
For more, make sure to:
- Follow me on Instagram @frenchie.ferenczi
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Frenchie: [00:00:00] Hello, hello, and welcome back to strategy snacks. I'm Frenchie Frenzy and I am so, so, so excited today because we are joined by Brenda Winkle who is an energy healer for high performers. Did I get that right?
Brenda: I think I got that right. Yeah, you did. Hi, Frenchie. Thank you
Frenchie: for having me. Of course, of course, I got to meet you when you joined Media Genius, which was a media Yeah.
Visibility event that we hosted in New York, me and Adela hosted in New York. And you just, as someone who has always been, what's the word? A little bit like skeptical of a lot of energy work, because I just feel like it's one of those worlds where there can just be like a lot of Frankly, bullshit floating around.
Um, I'm always like, uh, another energy healer. Like, what am I getting myself into? And so [00:01:00] when I got to meet you and just the, your presence and the way you showed up in the room, just like lit me up and I was like, Oh, she is the real deal and I am so lucky to have met her. So I'm so glad you're here and I would love for you to tell our listeners a little bit more
Brenda: about you.
Oh, thank you for that. I really appreciate that. You're right. There is a lot of bullshit in the energy healing world. And so it means a lot to, to just receive what you said. So I'm just letting that roll through my system feels really good. Thank you. So I am an energy healer for high performers and I help people amplify, elevate, and really sink into their soul's mission, helping them to get their message out into the world.
And so I do this through breath work. Somatic coaching and energy healing. And I host a podcast called Your Yes Filled Life. I love
Frenchie: that your Yes. Filled. Yeah. Life. Okay, wait, so let's just start there. I know, I know. I have my questions. We're gonna get to them, but [00:02:00] I just happen to know Brenda very well.
I've had the privilege of getting to know her, of getting to experience her work, and so I can't help myself so. So talk to me a little bit more, like what does, what, how do you define a yes to a life? What does that, what does that mean? What does that look
Brenda: like? And how do I get it? I love this question. So you know that feeling when you get your fists up in the air and you say, yes, yes, that's the yes filled life.
And so in order to get to the yes filled life, we have to be really discerning about what we're saying yes to. And we have to build the capacity to say no to the things that. Aren't a fit for us. And so like, when I think about how we met at the media genius event, that was a full body. Yes. For me, it was so exciting.
And the way that you hosted it so eloquently, and it was in a beautiful space and the content. It was literally life changing. My business trajectory changed completely after that event, and I'm just so grateful.
Frenchie: And you knew [00:03:00] you had that yes moment, hands in the air. Yeah. I love that. I love that. Okay. So I guess another follow up question, because like we said, right, the skepticism can run deep.
Talk to me a little bit about in your work, what does energy healing look like? Like, what modalities do you use and how are you working
Brenda: with people? So I was an educator for 26 years and I really value science. I value structure. I value strategy. And so I weave a lot of that into my energy work because I know that our structured minds, the logical parts of our, our brains need something to ground into.
And so I offer a lot of really sound science. It's been around. Interestingly, for hundreds of years. So energy medicine first came about in like the 1880s and breathwork has been around since before recorded history. And so all of these healing modalities have been around a long time and now there's science to [00:04:00] prove it.
And so there's new research studies coming out all the time and I'm such a nerd. I have Google alerts set for, um, breath work, somatic coaching, somatic healing, all those things. So that I'm staying up on the science as it comes, as it comes out. And so, so there's the science piece of it, which helps reduce.
any skepticism. It helps reduce that resistance that people have. When I say to their structured mind, here's what we're going to do, and here's why it works. And then we do it. So the truth is our bodies, our, our whole energetic system stores information from our lived experiences. And when we can just put awareness And so if I were to sum up what we do, we are healing unhealed parts of ourselves, whether those are child parts or protector parts, so that those little parts of us are not [00:05:00] making the big decisions, especially in our businesses or our lives, because nobody wants an eight year old running their business.
Frenchie: Touche. Touche. Yeah. When my, when my eight year old me is trying to run my business, I'm like, girl, calm it down.
Brenda: Same. I'm like, okay, time for a walk.
Frenchie: That is awesome. And I think that's so, you know, I think that it's, I love that what you bring is this grounded reality and science to it, because I think a lot of people want to believe that, you know, to use their words, this stuff.
Works and then it's hard to know the woo. Um, and it's hard to know how or why and some stuff works better than others. And I think what I found particularly profound about your work is that I tend to be a little bit like mindset averse, right? And I think that's just because like, I just personally don't believe that you like it.
Think your [00:06:00] way through mindset blocks, right? Like totally, you act your way through mindset blocks. And what I love about where you live is it's in this like really, it's like almost like in the Venn diagram of there's this huge like psycho emotional piece, but there's also this like very action oriented piece to it.
And you kind of like, live right in the middle of those two spaces so that you are opening up the space for people to overcome mindset blocks, but also to take action and move forward and make progress in the ways that they want to make progress in their lives and wellbeing.
Brenda: Thank you for saying that there's a lot of research to say mindset alone does not work because you can't.
Think your way out of a problem and you can think positively, but if you're not actually getting to the root cause of what is causing behaviors that might be holding you back or sabotaging you, if you're not addressing those in the body, in the nervous system, there's a cap. [00:07:00] You can only go so far. You got to get into the body to allow that healing to really take root.
Frenchie: I love it. And so I think this is a really good time to kind of dive into our strategy snacks question. Because one of the things that I love about the show and about bringing guests like you onto the show is that you do all of this work and you're running a business. And I think that sometimes when you're an energy healer, people think that you're like, You know, Jesus, and you're just supposed to go around healing people and, you know, like doing it for free or whatever.
And it's like, no, there's also the business side. There's also the life that you need to support and both things go hand in hand. So I kind of want to shift gears to really talking about your work in the lens of your business and your business journey after so many years as an educator. Um, so for starters, talk to us a little bit, like what was one of your biggest business wins or celebrations?
Hmm.
Brenda: Okay. So I was, I was [00:08:00] stuck back on, on your statement about how it is to be a healer in a world where sometimes we have healer wounds that tell us we have to work for free. And so I'm going to come back to that in a minute. Yeah. So I was just giving my system a chance to, to recognize that. And then to answer your question, one of the biggest wins is.
I finished my first full year as an entrepreneur and it just feels so good after having the safety and security, quote unquote, of the school system for all that time to go out on my own, to figure out my own insurance, my own retirement plan, my own income belt. Huge. And I'm just like ridiculously proud of that.
Yeah.
Frenchie: As you should be. As you should be. Right? Like just, I think that self reliance is obviously not the ultimate goal, but there's something really empowering about creating and building something that is entirely ours. [00:09:00] Yeah.
Brenda: Yeah.
Frenchie: Um, so wait, let's go back to kind of what we, what we put in, which is like that healers should be doing their work for free.
Brenda: Exactly. So as an energy healer, I'm going to approach it from this standpoint. Everything is an energy exchange. And if there's not an energy exchange, we put ourselves into an energetic deficit, which means that we're giving more than we're receiving. And so if you think about this from. Let's say something really tactical and tangible, think about it as a pitcher of water.
Okay. So if I'm pouring out from my pitcher of water into a glass, And then I put my picture back on the counter and I don't refill that picture in some capacity at a certain point. I'm not going to have anything left to pour into glasses. And so many times healers think, Oh, I have this gift of healing, or I've just learned this healing modality.
And. I just have to give it away for free because that's what I'm [00:10:00] called to do. But we're ignoring the energy exchange and that is imperative because if we're not allowing that energy exchange to complete the circuit, you don't have enough energy to give. Right. And I'm realizing I didn't answer one of your questions about the types of energy healing that I offer.
Oh, yeah. So I'm certified as a trauma informed Reiki master, an advanced Theta healing practitioner, advanced clandenting technique. I'm certified as an advanced trauma informed breathwork facilitator. And a somatic coach and I have a master's degree in educational leadership.
Frenchie: So it's okay. You're not really that qualified, but I'm glad you're here.
It's cute. Um, so anyways, I think that, you know, that exchange I think is a really important piece because I think that what people tell me if this is true or not, I'm projecting, but people don't necessarily realize that the energy healing work is like. [00:11:00] It goes both ways. Both people need to be invested in it.
You can't fix someone who doesn't want to fix themselves. And fix is obviously not the word that we're looking for here, but let's just pretend we're talking about vases for a second. Like, you can't fix a vase that doesn't want to, like, be, be a vase anymore, you know? And so I think that having that level of investment on both ends is what yields the results.
And And it's tricky to me to have this conversation because I also realized this is how some people start to like manipulate the conversation of like, Oh, so you need to charge a lot, but like, cause if not, I'm not going to get results and all that. But I also think like, let's just put that piece aside.
In every other field, if someone is as credentialed and qualified as you are, we would expect to be spending and like paying that person a fair rate for their [00:12:00] experience and the work that they do. Right. And so why is it that so many of us bring our own doubts around it, um, when it comes to something that's less tangible,
Brenda: I think.
I think there's a couple of reasons. One is unhealthy money stories. And so we have stored in our nervous systems, the money stories of our parents, of our partners, of the people that were around. And so we have these, these unhealthy money stories. The other piece is that it doesn't matter what you're charging.
As long as there's an energy exchange that feels energy rich to you, you could charge nothing and have like, so there's no money exchange, but you're exchanging energies. So perhaps like maybe you're a Reiki practitioner and you exchange With a massage therapist, there's an energy exchange where it gets [00:13:00] really muddy is when the energy exchange isn't equal.
And so that can get kind of crunchy. So just like caution, don't do only exchanges because you will eventually burn out because, you know, if you're not being compensated for what you're doing, you're going to lose motivation to do it. And you're going to find something else to do it. And the other thing is let's talk about sustainable wages.
If you're charging 60 a session for your healing gifts, think about how many sessions you would have to hold in a week or a month in order to pay your bills. It's not sustainable. And you know, when we're talking about energy, if you are an energy healer, people are paying you for your energy, which means that you need to prioritize your energy, which means you have to be taking care of yourself, creating space in your calendar to hold space for other people so that you can actually [00:14:00] hold for them what they need to have healed.
Because that is the thing you're holding it for them. You're not healing it for them. You're holding the space You're the facilitator. And so that's the piece that a lot of people don't get is that in order for me to Really hold the space for your transformation. My energy is my number one priority
Frenchie: That totally makes sense.
Totally. Okay. So, you know, you kind of, you spoke to this idea of like, are you actually charging enough? And that sort of thing. One of the questions I always ask on this show is what's one of the hardest business lessons you've had to learn. And I'm curious if that was a hard lesson for you to learn. Or if you already do that lesson and there was something else.
So I'd love to kind of hear your answer there.
Brenda: Well, yeah, I definitely had to learn that lesson. That was, I mean, that 60 rate, that was my rate. That's why I chose that. I had a feeling. Yeah. Yeah. So I definitely had to learn that lesson, but I think an even more important lesson [00:15:00] was that if I'm going to follow energy, I believe we all should follow our energy.
When my energy is richest, is when I hold appointments, not when it's convenient for the people. So in every single case that I had somebody say, I really wish you held sessions on a Saturday, or I really wish I could see you on a Sunday afternoon. They either one didn't want to pay for it or two never booked without exception.
And so the minute that I said, this is my calendar. These are my working hours, everything in my business shifted because there's almost this people pleasing thing that we start out with in our businesses. And we think, Oh, I've got to make sure my schedule works for everyone. But if we're doing that, we're depleting our own energy.
And so, the minute I learned, and it was hard, it was really scary, to set my own calendar that worked for me, I kept thinking, [00:16:00] what if this really doesn't work? But it does work, because people can feel it when you log on at like 8pm at night and you don't want to be there. They can feel it.
Frenchie: I love it. I love it.
Okay. So all of this being said, I mean, God, there's just been so much goodness in this conversation, but what is one strategy snack that you want to share with our listeners? Business tip, energy tip, any, anything that you think any business owner really needs to have in their back pocket.
Brenda: Um, so I think that there's two, but they're, they're related and we're just going to call it energy generation.
So one is create white space in your calendar. And by white space, I mean literally do nothing space. So even if that, if that feels like really triggering for you because you are used to being in the hustle, just set a timer for one minute and sit there and watch the timer countdown. [00:17:00] That white space is when you're going to have the divine downloads.
That's when the ideas are going to come through. That's when you have the access to your higher self. That white space is essential. And then that leads us to number two, not all of us. Process information the same way. And so many of us were taught that we have to sit still and work. So we're like glued to our chair, glued to our desk, and then we're typing and we're, you know, huddled over the keyboard and we're working, working, working.
And then we keep thinking, why am I not getting the creative ideas? It might be because you have a body intelligence you're not tapping into. So we've got three intuitive bodies. We've got the mental field in our head. We've got the emotional body, which lives just right outside the heart. And then we've got the intuitive body, which is just around the outside of the belly for most of us in order to activate that intuitive belly.
We need movement. So build in movement breaks and move [00:18:00] around even your desk. If you, if you get stuck in an idea, just sometimes standing up, turning around, wiggling a little bit, and then sitting back down, it'll free that idea. Okay.
Frenchie: Very cool. Very cool. Also, when you talked about blank space, my first. Um, reaction was like, okay, but what do I do in that blank space, which sounds like is not the point.
So if anybody else felt that way, um, I'm going to try the timer trick because I also don't know what to do. I don't know how to just not do anything. It's never, it's not in my, it's not in my
bones.
Brenda: We're not taught that. We're not taught that. I was the, like the, I held the flag of the hustle culture at one point in life.
I was like working 70 hours a week, so I totally resonate with them. What do you mean? Do nothing for a minute. That seems like almost painful, but I promise that by the time you get done with one minute, you're going to feel like you can take a deeper breath. You're gonna feel like you have more access to the creative thoughts.[00:19:00]
Frenchie: Brenda, you are amazing. You're incredible at what you do. You are just an awesome person that I feel very lucky to know. How can our listeners connect you, connect with you, find you, and get to know you more?
Brenda: Thank you for having me, Frenchie. I so appreciate your mentorship and everything that I've learned from you.
It's been an honor to be in your community and to work with you. Thank you for having me. Of course. I am on Instagram at Brenda Winkle. I'm on Tik TOK at Brenda Winkle one, one, one, and my website, which is probably the easiest way to get me is Brenda Winkle. com because that has links to everything. I love
Frenchie: it.
I love it. We will link all of that in the show notes so that you can connect with Brenda and really get to know more about her work. Um, check out the types of ways that you can work with her. It really is life changing and I'm so glad that you were here today. I'm so glad all of you had a chance to listen to this episode and we'll be back soon with more strategy snacks.
Bye everyone.